How about to scam the scam?

HyipIndex

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After having a discussion with @Marengo over one of the investors classification “ Opportunists” , well you can read it here . I believe that these guys actually answered the one question that remained unanswered in the hyip industry for years: how to fight scam?

Well how about to scam the scam? Yes, I know that it does sound funny but still. Let’s see how the scam work. They pay a lot for an advertisement and to hyip monitors. Then they collect certain amount of cash in their balance and run away with it.

BUT! In the first couple payouts the scam hyip cannot afford not to pay, in order to keep their paying status. So, everyone, get paid one time and leave the program. This will force scam admin lose money and at some point, he will get disappointed and stop.

I guess that is the way, earn cash while fighting scams!
 
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Marengo

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@HyipIndex I refresh my memory - the opportunists are the same HIT&RUNers with their HIT-and-RUN strategy. Their main goal is to invest in the HYIP and withdraw the principle as quickly as possible.
 
HyipIndex

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@HyipIndex I refresh my memory - the opportunists are the same HIT&RUNers with their HIT-and-RUN strategy. Their main goal is to invest in the HYIP and withdraw the principle as quickly as possible.
True that is about it! laughs. I guess that is the only strategy with scams that is.
 
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@HyipIndex An interesting fact - on all forums and blogs I read is propaganda against HIT&RUN strategy :cautious:
 
HyipIndex

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@HyipIndex An interesting fact - on all forums and blogs I read is propaganda against HIT&RUN strategy :cautious:
let's look at it this way. For normal long term hyip, hit and run is not a problem at all, because even those who hit and run when they see that hyip is stable and paying they return. But for scam it is a huge issue. If you hit and run the scam, they simply cannot profit from it. And since scam do not actually invest money or do anything with the deposits, they cannot hold long enough.

And this is where interesting part is. A lot of people who actually own hyip-monitors and some low rep forums who sell advertising to the scam, afraid that if scamming will became not worthy, then less scam hyips will be appearing. You would say... and that is a bad thing? Well for these guys it is. Because if we have less scam this means less advertising on their websites and no money. And that means they do not want scam to stop since they take part of scammed money for advertising. Thus the propaganda and attempt to form general social opinion on blogs and forums that hit and run is a bad bad thing is reasonable.

And this is sad reality because people think that only scam admins profit from stolen money. No, that is not true. Monitors profit, advertisers profit, scam admin profit, but only few from investors part actually manage to profit.

Any financial analytic or those who work in banking and general investment industry will backup my words. Because this is how more or less entire financial system work.

let's look at the statistics in order to justify what I am saying here, and this is most likely what no one really want to talk about.

Every month we have on average 600 to 800 new hyip appears. And in same average 500 to 700 hyips go scam. And that is every single month!

Now how this thing works

In August 2019 we had roughly 2.3 mil USD deposited in hyips. Payouts for same month were around 200 thousand USD. Now 2.1 million USD gap, where you think the money go?

Well when scam start new hyip, they take money they scammed from previous month and start spending them on advertising and on monitoring. The more you spend on advertising and monitoring the more new victims you approach.

This is where blogs, forums and monitors making their money. The rest go to payout expenses in order to be able to pay some of the investors and monitors. The rest money go to scam.

If we really look at it all there is over 50 top paying hyips that are alive more than 90 days. All the rest 600 to 700 hyips appear and disappear every month.

That is it ;)
 
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Marengo

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@HyipIndex I am wondering by your responses
I have long understood that the most profitable way to make money in the HYIP industry is to create your own HYIP. It is just as illegal as not paying taxes on the profit from HYIPs. Especially if you equate them to winning the lottery, where the lucky ones must give back more than 30% of the winnings.
I think a net investor always loses money. After all, there is no way to 100% find a stable project.
 
6FigP

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Scamming the scam is literally what I do most of the time. I don't care how long it's been running, or what it's about. All of these programs are typically scams. If all the investments are not made transparent, then the risk you're taking is astronomically more than anything trustworthy. Getting in early, and getting out has made me a lot of money, while I only lost investing long term. Hourly payouts reduce risk so I love those when acceptable. I'm real picky now though. Easily can say 98% of these things in my personal experience exit and it feels damn good to ride off into the sunset profit+principle and all👌🏽
 
HyipIndex

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@HyipIndex I am wondering by your responses
I have long understood that the most profitable way to make money in the HYIP industry is to create your own HYIP. It is just as illegal as not paying taxes on the profit from HYIPs. Especially if you equate them to winning the lottery, where the lucky ones must give back more than 30% of the winnings.
I think a net investor always loses money. After all, there is no way to 100% find a stable project.
Exactly, there is no 100% anywhere anymore.
 
HyipIndex

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Scamming the scam is literally what I do most of the time. I don't care how long it's been running, or what it's about. All of these programs are typically scams. If all the investments are not made transparent, then the risk you're taking is astronomically more than anything trustworthy. Getting in early, and getting out has made me a lot of money, while I only lost investing long term. Hourly payouts reduce risk so I love those when acceptable. I'm real picky now though. Easily can say 98% of these things in my personal experience exit and it feels damn good to ride off into the sunset profit+principle and all👌🏽
That's about right!
 
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@6FigP You are right - Playing to win! I can't find the time to read this book. The author of this book talks about the theory of Players and Losers. A loser is one who voluntarily restricts himself to rules that the system knows nothing about.
It is very easy to understand that someone is a loser when he speaks of "honesty". A game is an impartial, closed system. There are rules of this system that impose restrictions on players. Everything is simple, the more rules, the more difficult it is to achieve victorious conditions. If you come up with additional rules, you put yourself at a disadvantage. Games cannot be "honesty".
HYIP is a game, isn't it? ;)
 
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HyipIndex

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@6FigP You are right - Playing to win! I can't find the time to read this book. The author of this book talks about the theory of Players and Losers. A loser is one who voluntarily restricts himself to rules that the system knows nothing about.
It is very easy to understand that someone is a loser when he speaks of "honesty". A game is an impartial, closed system. There are rules of this system that impose restrictions on players. Everything is simple, the more rules, the more difficult it is to achieve victorious conditions. If you come up with additional rules, you put yourself at a disadvantage. Games cannot be "honesty".
HYIP is a game, isn't it? ;)
I believe you are right, but every game have the rules. If we look at the definition of game it self.... A game is an activity usually involving skill, knowledge, or chance, in which you follow fixed rules and try to win against an opponent. No rules is no longer a game. Hyip is a game and there are rules not ethical not moral for that matter.

In HYIP game there are set of fixed rules as well :

Rule one : in order to play HYIP game you must make a deposit and risk your money

Rule two: The one with skills and knowledge have the edge

Rules three : in HYIP there is a chance that you can earn and chance that you can lose.

In the end of the game either scam win or depositor win.

So at this point if you do not follow the rule one here you simply cannot play the HYIP game . And we can discuss about putting our selves in disadvantage because we think we do not want follow the rules and we want make profit from hyip without deposit and risk. But hyip admins do not really care about it and do not really care what you think. There is a rule of the hyip game, and you must follow it if you want to play. You do not deposit with risk, well then they will not be playing with you.

Game by it self cannot be honest, and players cannot be honest in a game, so that is why there are rules to control the game process for that matter alone. Looser is the one who start playing game without skills and the knowledge of the game is playing and what are the rules. Those who know the rules and have the skills to use them in their advantage, are winners.

So honesty.... well, I am not sure what honesty have to do with it. if you enter a game that have RISK loosing, then when you lose you cannot blame some one braking the rule and run out with your money. Because in HYIP game, when admin scamming and run away with money, he do not brake any rule. Since the rule of the hyip game is, Somme one win and someone lose.
 
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Marengo

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@HyipIndex I mean, there is no rule not to use Hit and Run strategy. Players who don't use it are less likely to claim a win.
 
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HyipIndex

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@HyipIndex I mean, there is no rule not to use Hit and Run strategy. Players who don't use it are less likely to claim a win.
I totally agree with you, Hit & Run is one of the main short term investment strategy and in financial world we call it : "Scalping " The purpose of scalping is to make a profit by buying or selling currencies or stocks or commodities and holding the position for a very short time and closing it for a small profit.

So as I said in my previous thread, those who trying to push the propaganda that hit and run is a bad thing, are mostly hyip owners that have hard time with their scam business :)

And this is where we can validate our rules discussion, there is rule to deposit money with risk, but there is no rules over the strategy. Hyip owners trying to push for additional rules, well in this case those who follow the additional NO HIT&RUN rule, are bunch of losers.
 
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6FigP

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I believe you are right, but every game have the rules. If we look at the definition of game it self.... A game is an activity usually involving skill, knowledge, or chance, in which you follow fixed rules and try to win against an opponent. No rules is no longer a game. Hyip is a game and there are rules not ethical not moral for that matter.

In HYIP game there are set of fixed rules as well :

Rule one : in order to play HYIP game you must make a deposit and risk your money

Rule two: The one with skills and knowledge have the edge

Rules three : in HYIP there is a chance that you can earn and chance that you can lose.

In the end of the game either scam win or depositor win.

So at this point if you do not follow the rule one here you simply cannot play the HYIP game . And we can discuss about putting our selves in disadvantage because we think we do not want follow the rules and we want make profit from hyip without deposit and risk. But hyip admins do not really care about it and do not really care what you think. There is a rule of the hyip game, and you must follow it if you want to play. You do not deposit with risk, well then they will not be playing with you.

Game by it self cannot be honest, and players cannot be honest in a game, so that is why there are rules to control the game process for that matter alone. Looser is the one who start playing game without skills and the knowledge of the game is playing and what are the rules. Those who know the rules and have the skills to use them in their advantage, are winners.

So honesty.... well, I am not sure what honesty have to do with it. if you enter a game that have RISK loosing, then when you lose you cannot blame some one braking the rule and run out with your money. Because in HYIP game, when admin scamming and run away with money, he do not brake any rule. Since the rule of the hyip game is, Somme one win and someone lose.
Truth. All my risks are calculated and weighed. The hyips themselves can be dishonest, but I'm always transparent with anything I speak of publicly. If I'm throwing my money down the drain, all of my followers can see avoid getting played themselves.

Well said though👍🏽
 
HyipIndex

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Truth. All my risks are calculated and weighed. The hyips themselves can be dishonest, but I'm always transparent with anything I speak of publicly. If I'm throwing my money down the drain, all of my followers can see avoid getting played themselves.

Well said though👍🏽
Absolutely agree with you there! transparency is they key with it!!
 
Tom_the_Hyipster

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Scamming the scam is literally what I do most of the time. I don't care how long it's been running, or what it's about. All of these programs are typically scams. If all the investments are not made transparent, then the risk you're taking is astronomically more than anything trustworthy. Getting in early, and getting out has made me a lot of money, while I only lost investing long term. Hourly payouts reduce risk so I love those when acceptable. I'm real picky now though. Easily can say 98% of these things in my personal experience exit and it feels damn good to ride off into the sunset profit+principle and all👌🏽
Most of times the problem with hourly hyips is that you can play only with low amounts. That's my problem with them. I love hourly hyips and I love the hit and run strategy, most of times help me make good profits. But they have the big issue of the amount. That's one of the reason why I mix kind of investments into short/middle/long term projects. Divide the investments help me a lot to avoid big losses. For example last months i make good money with copy/paste hourly hyips. I helped a lot of people and followers by following my strategy. The result was that usually they random ban my followers from their projects, or scam them also with amounts like 70/100$. So I forced myself to stop with that kind of hyips or invest in hourly hyips that I'm sure are not drive from same admins that replace their shit 2times a week.
 
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There is another problem in my opinion. If I proposte people hourly hyips with 4-6% daily return they run to subscribe, if I propose them more stable and trusted platforms, most of them don't invest. And, obviously, after I repeated 10k times how to play pretty safe in hourly hyips, 80% don't take back profits in time before the scam date. Sometimes I think someone deserve to lose money. Anyway this world is pretty more gambling and we can't forgot this.
 
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6FigP

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There is another problem in my opinion. If I proposte people hourly hyips with 4-6% daily return they run to subscribe, if I propose them more stable and trusted platforms, most of them don't invest. And, obviously, after I repeated 10k times how to play pretty safe in hourly hyips, 80% don't take back profits in time before the scam date. Sometimes I think someone deserve to lose money. Anyway this world is pretty more gambling and we can't forgot this.
Indeed. Which is why I tend to keep most hyips to myself. My inner network knows what's up without me having to explain much. We're all adults. If you're not knowledgeable, or skilled, you really shouldn't even be playing around with hyips. Because that's all you're doing if you're ignorant to the risks and how hyips work... Playing...

Play with fire, get burned. Play with money, get burned and lose it all. Timing is always key. I see a lot of influences and You tubers leading sheeple to slaughter with hyips, all these super wallets, etc... There are plenty of legitimate programs out. But the allure will always get people regardless. Won't catch me doing it. Exclusive videos and risky business only go to the private subs and inner circle.
 
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